I put a lot of emphasis here on automated link building methods. This is because they are highly effective for my business model and the model I discuss on this blog. These methods have a weakness though and that is that they lack effectiveness for competitive niches. So I’d like to discuss a link building method that is under discussed in the “make money” niche by almost everyone, but Griz. It is organic social networking.
Forget everything you’re thinking right now. I’m not discussing twitter, facebook, digg, or stumbleupon. Those systems are amazing, but have replaced quality with quantity. By organic social networking for SEO, I mean make friends. This is web 1.0 social networking. The strongest link building tools I own are my friendships. I’ve earn links with good content. I’ve made useful themes. I’ve “built links”, but friends can provide me with powerful links.
Too often we want to set apart our online business as something “different”. People think that offline rules do not apply online and this is why so many fail online and a small set really take off. Your online business adds new rules and changes conditions, but does not eliminate the value of human relationships. Offline businesses have entire departments related to socializing with other business, vendors, and customers. These people maintain good relationships and leverage them for the benefit of the business. Why do people want to escape this online?
If you are interested in dominating a niche, you NEED to talk to the people involved in it. A year and a half ago, I knew nobody in internet marketing. Today, I can open up my email and ask some pretty big name bloggers questions directly if I need to (I don’t do it often though) and I am almost 100% sure I’ll get an answer. I trade links with these guys and we help each other out. I think the only blogger who’s been rude about things is Garry Conn. I’ve had the little “hey can you vote on this or comment on that”, I willingly accept and help him out. I check out his site periodically and try to avoid the dislike I have for some of the things he does. He’s just making a living like everyone else. I like having more friends than enemies. The only negative is that somehow this got me put on his list of “spam him to death with shit”. He’s a perfect example of how to not do “organic social networking”. He’s using a shotgun approach and not trying to connect with me.
So I’m not an A-List blogger, but I’m a growing “SEO” blogger who’s starting to take spots in the top 20 for several SEO terms. I’m growing nicely, even though I’m a little lazy with this blog. I’m not a celebrity, but I “know SEO”. We’ll here is the IM I got from Garry Conn a few days ago. (This is through instant message (gtalk) and not email)
Garry: Hey bud… I am going to be leaving out tomorrow very early. I wrote a post on my blog that I know that you’ll enjoy reading. Here is the link: http://www.garryconn.com/how-to-make-money-online-with-google-analytics.php be sure to leave me a comment and share your feedback or questions with me, I am here to help. Talk to you again in a few days.
Ok, a few things here. I think it is bad form to just spam someone with a post through IM. If you want to ask me something like “tweet this” or “vote this”, ok, that’s different. He’s just trying to get me to visit his site, so he’s trying to market to me, not “network”. Second, he calls me “bud”. We are not close and sending this message to me shows he doesn’t know me well. He is giving me a post to help me get more value out of Google analytics. Seriously, Garry Conn wants to teach me analytics. And he insults me further by saying “I am here to help”. Does he know I run a blog where I help people? I wouldn’t send an email to Courtney Tuttle saying “hey bud, here is a post to teach you about keywords, if you need help, let me know”. (Court runs at site about making money with keywords and ranks page one for “Internet marketing”) Court would open it up and think “wtf Justin, why are you pitching me this”. If Garry sent me a post about something new or something more advanced, it would be more targeted.
I do well with the term SEO, I could actually pass Garry a really valuable link if he ever became a friend of mine. He even had a distinct advantage, because I talked with him because he’s from my area (we could meet in person). Instead he treated me as a number and ruined the chance to “network with me”. Honestly, I would have not been bothered by his message if it was an email. I get marketed to through email all the time. I’m a marketer, I get it, and I assume I’m just on a “list”. Email doesn’t bother me, but he did this through instant message.
I wanted to use Garry as an example to illustrate the difference in what I mean by networking. I do not mean “be friends with 100’s of people” and send them the same copy & paste message through IM. I mean “be GOOD friends with 5 people in each of your niches”. I’m really bad at answering emails and socializing with people on this blog because I get too busy, but I actively seek out webmasters in each major niche I work. I don’t mean to ignore those who try to network with me, but it’s a numbers game sometimes and time limits create priorities. (it sucks)
My most successful site to date came from being involved in a forum in that niche. In addition, I got to know 4 other bloggers in that niche. I spent a few weeks commenting regularly on their blog, and then I pitched them through email. I asked for a link trade or a triangle trade (I owned another blog in the niche). I ran one of the best blogs in that niche (but was new, so not ranking) and was very nice in their comments, so when I made this pitch they were more than happy to link to me. Well in SEO, when 4 of the sites in the top 10 link to you, it does a lot for your rankings. The ROI on the time I spent was better than any automated method for link building.
You do not always have to use linkbait and content to reach the first page (although they help). At the end of the day, the best links are given by PEOPLE. The best SEO tool you own is your email client. And don’t BS people, be real, these are relationships, not your list to market to.
Related Posts:
Gang Bang Your Competition Into Submission
Where to Find Link Partners
Automate Social Bookmarking
Why Use SEO? The Benefits of SEO
Make Money Online with Griz
{ 16 comments }
Hey Justin,
I really appreciate all the information you give out here. That is one thing I really like about SEO is everyone seems so willing to help.
I have a question about finding other people in a niche to work with. Wouldn’t those people look at you as competition because you are both trying to get to a #1 ranking or does it work because people are not targeting the same keywords.
I was just wondering what your thoughts are on that.
Thanks
I think it can be hard, but you can get your competition to link to you.
With this blog, I positioned myself in a way where I was able to get solid links from other solid internet marketing blogs. The SEO niche is saturated and it seems very unwelcoming to new SEO blogs. The make money niche however seems to rotate bloggers often. I made a my blog about “SEO for making money online”, which places me as a “make money online” blog, but I target SEO. I’ve got links from some MMO friends, but I’m not their direct competition. Sometimes its about finding closely related friends.
If you’re dealing with another SEO in your niche, they’ll either be paranoid or smart. Some marketers are smart enough to know that it is valuable to team up and create a us vs them. I’d rather be fighting my friend at spots number two and three, than be alone at number 12.
The worst SEO’s are the ones who know enough to be dangerous, but don’t really understand what they’re doing. These know they need links, but read that link trades aren’t as powerful, so they freak out over an exchange because its a “bad link”. I’ve had to debate with someone over this before, if they come back like that, I just move on.
Lastly, you can simply create an excellent product. Aaron Wall created the SEOBook Toolbar, which is amazing. Even though he is my competition, he created something so great it is worth mentioning.
But keep in mind too that many bloggers are not “SEO’s”. If you find a niche where the sites are just generic webmasters, then they’re trading links for traffic and not rankings, so they don’t get too upset. I’ve been a mean jerk in some niches and “exchanged” links, but put a nofollow on them. They were clueless and I earned an easy 1 way link. (I don’t recommend this with any legit sites, but I really wanted to rank for that term)
Justin: i’m liking your blog more and more with each post. This is a great one. I am lacking in the ’social networking’ area. i’ve probably heard a lot of this info here and there but you present it in a concise, simple way and I really like that you said the ROI makes sense. This was a motivating post – excellent.
Thanks so much for the comments.
I slack in the social area as well. =P
I have heard too much shit talk about Garry Conn to ever give him the time of day. This post not only makes me glad that I am not on his ’spam him to death with shit’ list, it is also a fine example of how to do things better!
Seriously, mate, your posts this year have been absolutely supreme. Top quality info, backed up with working examples. Just what I want from the internet!
Go and unsubscribe now!!!!
Thanks so much for the comments. I don’t hate on Garry like some bloggers, but had a few issues.
I think Garry knows that “the only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about.”
People either like him or not, but he does get talked about, which is great for him.
Well said Justin,
I have been watching you on and off for about a year. You definately provide value to your readers. Here’s to your continued success with SEO consulting!
Thanks so much =)
Trying to step things up a bit.
I have a few comments on this…
Prior to getting involved in “real” MMO with the V/C/G, I was in a network formed by a very well known blogger DD… He is a very straight up guy and he set up this network for social media and internet marketing. Well, this network pretty much deteriorated to vote for me, digg me, stumble me, whatever. And most of the time the post wasn’t even good. This was never endorsed by DD, but that’s what it became. The people who got on the first page of Digg got their notoriety and soon everything they wrote got dugg because people wanted to kiss their ass. Therefore, SM and all this have left a bad taste in my mouth. I just couldn’t stand the brown nosing. Can’t do it in real life, and can’t do it online either.
My second point. I have the exact same thought as Agrande. I am trying to overcome my fear and paranoia of competition or revealing my keywords. I think that stems from the fact that new people in some ways have more to lose. They are riding on those few websites to do well. Some may be winners and others losers so again, that reduces their money sites. A-listers can repeat the processes over and over again because they have the resources: sites, money and friends. I’m trying to get over this fear and think for the longer term. If things don’t pan out or if they rank higher than me, then off it goes as a support site. Seeing as how effective the link building is with Griz’ support page, there’s no way I could duplicate that myself… without out of pocket expense.
The “exposing your niche” thing is hard and I deal with paranoia with it as well. The thing that keeps me sane is knowing that I can out work them. I’d say about 90% lack the determination to attack a niche for the long term. Even if they give me trouble, I can out last them.
Finding “friends” can be hard in some niches, but works better with “flagship” style blogs.
I’ve purposely avoided discussing higher level link methods here, because it goes against some of the recommendations of others in the MMO niche and may confuse people. As much as I’ve agreed that content is not king, it goes a LONG way in helping you gain legit links.
Good blog posts, guest posts, and good resources help generate a lot of links. I find teaching people how to create “noteworthy” content to be hard. Personally, I just do my best to be real and give advice. One in every 10 posts or so eventually stirs a bit of attention and I get a small cluster of links coming in. Solving problems gives tremendous value when when building links.
It does depend on your niche though. Not all advice applies to all sites.
i get my best links from other people i know. I am a pretty big name in travel blogging. I run one of the biggest websites out there for a personal blog. Whenever I start to build a new site in that niche for MMO purposes, i can call on hundreds of people to link to it. But that is only because I built a relationship with them via my blog. I help them and they help me.
In other niches, places like connect content and the griz page have been great sources of people who will help each other out. It’s a great way to get good links from people.
I go to great pains to build relationship with other people on the web. While automated link building is great, getting an in post link from a trusted site goes a lot further than anything linkvana or UAW can give me!
I agree 100%, too many people look at automated systems as a solution and THE link building method.
UAW and AM have their value, but I don’t think they are a replacement for link building and actual “marketing” yourself.
I keep slacking, but I’m planning on starting a huge blog in a non-MMO niche. I’ve seen some people with really nice flagship blogs in non-MMO niches and I’d love to do that. MMO traffic does not convert as well as my non-MMO niche blogs.
Hey bud… hehe (Justin)
Man, I think you’re off base. I have never done you wrong and totally never had any issues with you at all. Your post surprises me completely. Of all the people I talk to, you’re one who lives just 35 miles from me in Clarksville, TN. and one who I could meet up anytime. Sorry that this is your perception of me, perhaps one day we can change that. Congrats to your success, I do wish you well.
Best Regards,
Garry Conn
Garry,
It’s nothing I’m too work up over. I sat on this for a bit, but thought it’d apply to this post, which is the only reason I brought it up.
I’d disagree with you on the “never done you wrong” part. My first impression of you came from this comment you left about me.
“Clearly Justin is a total noob, I can tell that just in the YouTube video that he did over two weeks ago with less than 20 views.”
This was in reply to a post where I was being bashed for being critical of one’s man goal. This blog had only been up a short time at that point and wasn’t being promoted. You and Brent assumed I was a “noob” at SEO, because this site wasn’t even off the ground.
(btw, this has never been my money site, i use it mainly to help people out and network with fellow marketers)
I’m not trying to follow the typical A-List model and I try to keep things fairly unpolished around here.
I honestly have no bad feelings though and wish you well. At the end of the day, I know you’re just working hard to pay the bills and provide for your family, so I don’t take anything personal.
Good luck in the MMO niche, personally I’d never want to take on two of Griz’s site and Court’s site. The SEO niche isn’t any easier though.
Hey Justin I’ve been real busy on a new project and just now had time to get caught up on the few blogs I read every post on. Yours is at the top.
That was an absolutely classy reply to Mr. Conn (I won’t say anything about his name). You really showed a mature, professional attitude.
Hi Justin I am very impressed with this article. I know you through Vic’s affiliate academy and through a mutual acquaintance from there.
Yeah I am trying to be a better internet marketer and this was is a very fresh set of ideas. For a noob like me the first instinct is to just go get comment links or do link exchanges for my niche. It never occurred to me that I might do better networking. I’ll keep this in mind when I try to tackle the markets I am going into and look for friendships when possible.
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